Education Budgets: Spare the Knife?
The state, county and municipal budgets are undergoing much scrutiny to find ways to reduce expenses. This will most likely become a bigger issue if the Constitutional Amendment to further reduce property taxes passes in January 2008 and/or our economy (e.g., housing) does not pick up. Every governmental entity wants to make a case that budget reductions should not apply to them. One of the more vocal areas is education.
What do you think? Should our education system get some leeway from the budget cut knife? Why or why not?
NOTE: Since the City Election on October 16 is only for one position (Mayor), we will wait a week or so and then start a thread for comments on the Mayor’s race. The two City Council positions up for reelection were unopposed. A boring year for City political races.
posted by Blog Master @ 9:19 AM
49 Comments:
Voice of Reason says . . . .
Yes, the education budget needs to be cut - it is my understanding that the Marion County Public Schools budget is nearly 1/2 of a BILLION dollars!
I heard it through the grape vine that someone (as I predicted) saw Bobby James driving around in a new Cadillac since his new appointment to the School Board. Don't believe me, look in the parking lot at the next MCSB meeting - someone's got a new a Cadillac. That's a no-brainer, he's getting a new paycheck for about $3,000 per month to warm a seat twice a month on the School Board.
So are the other four boardmembers. That 1/64-wit Yancey is getting a lot more as superintendent (i.e. "Superdoofus.") How many other "administrators" and consultants and "specialists" are participating in the feeding frenzy?
Cut the school system budget? You bet.
VoR
I hope there is no way to trace my comment back to me. I might lose my job. You are on the right track, our system is administrator heavy. Only a couple of School Board members seem willing to push the problem.
I think Bobby may have had the Caddy before he was appointed.
QUESTION: What happens to Principals who fairly frequently overspend their school’s budget?
ANSWER: They become County School Board members.
Voice of Reason says . . . .
Kids in the public school system are simply numbers from the perspective of Washington, Tallahassee, the MCSB and administrators. Numbers translate directly into dollars. The vast majority of those folks operate under the old method:
1. your child is precious
2. he or she "deserves" the best education in the world
3. the best education in the world requires more and more money
4. more and more money increases our budget
5. as the budget gets bigger
6. as the budget gets bigger and bigger, administrators can say, "look, we have to oversee this huge budget and complicated organization, we deserve higher salaries."
7. They also say, "to oversee this important and complicated organization, we can only recruit the 'best and the brightest (ha,ha,ha) superintendents and administrators." Therefore, they ask for more money.
8. Budgets get increased, salaries go up and the numbers (students) get nothing out of the deal. Their taxpaying parents get nothing also.
9. The Cadillac dealership gets a few more sales.
VoR
Liz:
YOU'RE FIRED!!!!!!
I don’t know if the schools need budget reductions. However, we need to be sure that classroom education is getting its fair share of the budget. I don’t know whatever happened with the law that schools are required to spend 65% of their budget directly on classroom education. I would like to see that figure increased to 70%. That would make everyone look at budgets for all the extra expenses not related to children getting educated.
The school district should be treated just like the rest of us who work for the county, no special treatment should be given to their budgets. Suffer like the rest of us.
A 2003 survey of members of Congress by The Heritage Foundation found that 41 percent of U.S. representatives and 46 percent of U.S. senators now send or have sent at least one of their children to a private school.
It isn't just a matter of the upper crust. A far greater percentage of public school teachers around the country — especially in urban areas such as New York, Chicago, Los Angeles and Washington, D.C. — send their own kids to private schools than does the general public.
Meanwhile, only 12 percent of U.S. school children are educated privately.
Don’t spend so much time discusssing School budgets! The answer.......
VOUCHERS! VOUCHERS!
School recognition money should be eliminated.
Savings-$157.6 million.
Reason- This money is based upon school "grades" which are a bogus measure of a schools real performance.
Reduce- Teacher merit program by 20%.
Savings- $30 million
Reason- Merit plans not defined. New program. Don't have the money to fully fund it this year.
Ok that's $187 million and, it is not even noon yet.
-It is easy if you try.
Excuse my ignorance, but are those Marion County or state wide figures?
Statewide
After watching last weeks School Board Meeting, it's very obvious to see why our newest Principal turned Board Member never cared enough to keep within his School Budget. He's now instructing Yancey to just Hire more people. His qoute "I don't want to talk about this I just want it done"!
Re: Cafeteria Staff at Sunrise Elem>
Voice of Reason says . . . .
PWF, I have treid to tax my brain about Gordon Olson, and here's what I can remember:
I believe that he ran for Mayor in 1983 or 84. He was in his 50s or 60 and had long hair and a beard and rode a Harley long before this new crop of weekend motorcycle enthusiasts came around. He was absolute counter the status quo. He thought that Ocala was run by developers and construction folks. (He was probably right considering the terrible subdivisions, unimaginative cookie-cutter houses, and boring "milk carton" commercial buildings all around). He got some good press but did terrible in the election. I actually met up with him during the election and he thanked me in advance for my support and vote. He was honestly concerned with the future of Ocala at the time. He was sort of a novelty. I hope to actually spend some time in the Marion Co. Historical Society to get a little more scoop on him.
I do think, though, that you are on to something with his "House of Hobos" on Magnolia around your property. For some reason I think that you are right about that.
Getting back to impact fees, the Commission must go back an revisit the issue. $200,000 for a commercial office is outrageous on its face. And then to let the residential developers get away with such a comparatively low impact fee? One can only come away with the conclusion that the commission is overly sympathetic to residential developers. Add to that the developers are only allowing a few residential developments by a few (usual suspects) developers - and that the developments that have been allowed are out of date/unintelligent/unmarketable and further sprawl and it is clear that the opponents of revisiting the fee structure are old pay-n-play contributor/lobbyist-driven scheme. Next Fall, I am voting for anybody Independent. I can no longer take the status quo. Both Democrats and Republicans make me want to puke in my soup.
VoR
My opinion on School Budgets:
"Let them eat cake."
11:14 AM,
I bet there are millions more that could be taken out. The quote below identifies another area for reducing the education budgets, and beyond just the University level:
"It would have been a lot easier for me to get rid of two deadwood faculty." That's a quote from David Steadman, chair of the department of research and collections at the Florida Museum of Natural History. Speaking at a Faculty Senate meeting last week, Steadman was lamenting the fact that he was asked to make budget cuts from operational expenses instead of being able to simply lay off faculty. Steadman was told to trim $166,212 from operational expenses.
Do more with less people. Businesses and their employees have to do this all the time. Education should take a lesson from business.
Voice of Reason says . . .
I went to the Marion County School Board website looking for budget numbers. Nowhere to be seen. Unless someone can help me with that site, it seems the Board and Yancey are completely keeping numbers out of the public eye (without having to dig through public records buried somewhere).
What I did watch was some sorry video called something like Yancey's "state of the school system address" or something juvenile like that. Nowhere were numbers discussed. Just a bunch of flowery baloney about "achievement" and "excellence." Complete fluff - no substance at all.
The video featured an affirmative action "woman of color" Assistant Superintendent (I guess she is padding her resume to take over as head superdoofus somewhere) who spoke about playing the game King of the Hill as a child and how she is passionate about keeping Marion County public schools "King of the Hill!!!!" What hill is she talking about? Mount Marion (the landfill)???
Everyone should know by now that public schools are a complete cabal run by union bosses, uneducated administration useful idiots, school contractors (building, school lunch, soft drink, sports equipment, and supplies), and Big Race leaders.
To end the cabal, the money must be cut-off.
VoR
Gun Nutt says...
I recall in an earlier thread someone suggested that Voice of Reason's comments about Bobby James buying another Cadillac were thinly veiled racist remarks. I would like to point out that a Cadillac is just a product. It’s not racist to observe that certain people like certain products. A Cadillac is a perfectly nice product. The fact that black people like them is not an insult to black people. It does not suggest anything their lack of intelligence or taste.
It’s the same for watermelons. If black people like watermelons, so be it. They are a tasty and healthy food product suitable for human consumption. It says nothing bad about the character of black people to say that they enjoy eating watermelons. This type of misguided thinking comes from the Big Race industry. It gives them more people to label as racists and then extort money from.
I say if black people do not want to be known as people who eat watermelons, then perhaps they should stop eating them. The other option is they can form a secret society which meets behind closed doors solely for the purpose of eating watermelons without anyone knowing about it.
Voice of Reason says . . . .
Speaking of watermelon, one way that schools could cut budgets is by serving real food and not that fast food crap. Most food served in public schools is frozen fast food. If you visit a school, you will see that corporate fat food giants like Taco Bell, Pizza Hut, and others have taken over. When I went to school, there were usually some disgusting soyburgers floating around in green brine but , at least, they were freshly cooked by some loving lunch ladies. Now the lunch ladies microwave pizza hut pizzas or tacos for the little "numbers."
Studies show that the crappy foods that school cafeterias are serving makes kids fatter and lethargic. The food is also lacking in essential nutrients like Omega 3 fatty acids. Most credible scientists believe that the Nordic peoples have been so much more mentally alert and intelligent than other peoples of the world because of the diet high in Omega 3 fatty acids. But that doesn't matter, as long as Yancey has the prospect of getting some VP job with Sysco Foods or McDonalds when he finally gets off of the Marion County School System gravy train.
Schools should start a fresh and healthy food program. Why are Marion County prisoners eating much better than Marion County public school students?
VoR
….Ok that's $187 million and, it is not even noon yet.
Continuing on…. The next day before noon.
Due to the unforeseen decrease in state revenue, all state and local government employees (school boards, commissioners, legislators, judges, etc.) get a 3% pay cut. It may be returned in the event there is a substantial turn around in the state's revenues.
Savings- About $1 Billion
That’s just about $1.2 Billion (they can find the last few crumbs)
-See it really is easy if you try.
WOW! Great work yesterday and today.
If we could only get some members of the Legislature to read this on the Politically Homeless blog it might considerably shorten the length of the Special Session this month!
Anyone out there have a better idea?
Voice of Reason says . . .
Better reason than what? These have all been really good ideas.
VoR
Question to whoever wants to try and answer:
"Since the Legislature has seen fit to order a rollback on spending (Yeah, like anything is really going back!!!!) why did they allow every elected official in the state to receive a substantial pay increase in the new budgets?"
The legislature has the powner if it wanted to, to roll back all elected officials salaries to 2005 or 2004 or 2003 levels. Not only would it still make them substantially paid, but it would also save millions in retirement and other benefits we get nailed for each year.
So, you folks who have such an inroad to Bro. Kelly, to my friend Larry, and any other state legislator, house and senate, who has the guts to include this in the special session? --pwf
That should say the legislature has the power . . .--pwf
Hey Blogmaster, I see in the Blunder that a few Dems have filed for local offices, can we start a thread about that? Diana Butler, Sizemore, Ray Strictland?
I haven't seen anything from our friend Nancy Stacy about the education budget question. Would like to hear from her if she is still looking in from time to time. Her comments are always eye opening and controversial.
It appears the budget axe will not be spared to education by the legislature:
http://www.jacksonville.com/tu-online/stories/090407/met_196659557.shtml
Let's see if they follow through!
Crist's being stubborn on raising the univeersity tuitions. He needs to get off his high horse and bite the bullet. I heard some UF students say tonight that the increases should be put in.
Gun Nutt says...
You're right...I'm definately not a liberal Democrat.
Not good news!
State Legislative leaders have abruptly cancelled the three-week Special Session scheduled to start Sept. 18. No new date has been set. However, the notice sent cancelling the Session expressed confidence that a fall Special Session would still be scheduled at a later date.
Apparently, there is some disagreement between the House and Senate on a “framework for action”.
Can only assume that means the House wants to cut the budget more than the Senate. What else is new?
To Anony. 11:36 - I saw the piece I believe you are referring to on last nights news "I heard some UF students say tonight that the increases should be put in". The student also said, that the increase should not go to the athletic department, but to solving the overcrowding situation that exists. In a round about way what I think he was saying, was how can we justify paying the coach of a football team such an exorbitant amount of money, yet we have to raise tuitions to do so. Funny how tuition was not a problem until UF decided to pay their coach such a rediculous amount of money to stay. So the "real" students have to suffer because UF only cares about being football greats instead of academics?. And we wonder why education has suffered.
Those college kids are smarter about the economics of running a university than our own Governor.
Voice of Reason says . . . .
I share your frustration 9:55 Anon - However, I'm not sure about how much public money goes to pay the coaches but I think that a considerable amount of public funds do support the athletics in some manner. A lot of that money comes from imbeciles who have no life and who find self-esteem in giving large sums to athletics through "booster" organizations. What they get in return is the ability to wear a school-colored shirt on Monday after the guys on their team runs with a ball better than the guys on the other team.
It starts locally - look how much goes into sports at the city and public school levels.
VoR
Voice, my recollection is coac hes are paid only what a like job description would allow from PUBLIC TAX money.
The University Athletic Association, funded with large donations from alumni and others interested in sports then makes up the balance of the $3-$4,000,000 salaries. At one time, Bobby Bowden got more in tax money then Steve Spurrier, and the FSU alumns then kicked in the balance of his then $2 mil.
Nothing better than paying Cox a buck or two per day each month and staying home in nice air conditioning or heat and watching maybe three-four games until, of course, sleep kicks in and you get an hour or two nap while those in the stadium swelter. --pwf
Sounds like the delay in the special session is a cop out to making some hard decisions about the state budget.
Voice says in this thread:
"The video featured an affirmative action "woman of color" Assistant Superintendent (I guess she is padding her resume to take over as head superdoofus somewhere) who spoke about playing the game King of the Hill as a child and how she is passionate about keeping Marion County public schools "King of the Hill!!!!" What hill is she talking about? Mount Marion (the landfill)???
I have not seen the video. I do know the person, Dr. Diana Greene, and have known her since her high school days. No, she isn't trying to "pad a resume". She doesn't need to do such. This is a woman who is a committed educator and who has worked very hard at improving our schools and by the way, she happens to be Black.
Diana Stafford was a state class track star at Vanguard, an excellent girls basketball player (on a state championship team) who gave up sports to spend her time on her studies.
Her academic background is outstanding -- far greater than most of the posters on this blog, especially mine. Her work ethic is great, and if you would take the time to follow her around and understand what she is trying to do within education, working within a system she did not create to improve education.
She holds a BS from University of North Florida, a Masters from Nova, and her Doctorate of Philosophy-K-12 Education from
Capella University
Dr. Greene is one who will leave this world better than she inherited it. I am proud to have watched her develop. She des not deserve such a stupid comment.
--pwf
Voice of Reason says . . .
PWF, The most impressive thing that you said about Mrs. Greene is that she cares about public school - if that is true than she is unusual because so many in that cabal are in it just to milk it for all it is worth. As far as her athletic achievements, who cares? Her high school extra-curricular activities might have helped her stay in shape but they did nothing for others in the community and, in fact, cost other taxpayer's money to fund her fun. As far as her academic achievements, I don't see anything to get excited about - it is a well known fact that education departments at universities are not even considered programs at all. They are a joke. GRADUATE classes in education at a major university include making murals from magazine cuttings and pasting self-esteem messages on the walls. Complete baloney. Her highest "degree" is from Capella University which appears to be an online gimmick. The game there is that county school systems pay more for more "degrees" and often pay for the "educators" to get those degrees. Employees can pursue these so-called degrees even while at work on the public dole. The online classes are nothing like a real university experience and are solely designed to pump-out easy degrees for cash. Normally in the workplace, any smart person with a good work history of value to a company or institution can compete favorably agaisnt someone with such a manufactured degree. For instance, the quality high school education and real world experience of people of PWF's generation were extremely competent and valuable in the workplace. The danger with "Capella" type degrees is when they are combined with affirmative action and "diversity" goals. Then, a woman of color who is far less capable and competent than others (but who has a "degree" in education) overleaps the more capable and competent. Europe and developing countries are putting far less emphasis on university type degrees and much more on actual performance. In fact, if you look at who is really shaping the new world, you will see much less university education than real world ability.
VoR
Gun Nutt says...
Getting back to the idea that sports are over rated and over funded, I would like to add that alomost as irritating as governments spending money on sports teams is the corporations who do it. The people who make the decisions to give away a load of money to the team do so without the cost of it actually being their money that they gave away. That's right, they give away the shareholder's money. That means if you have a 401(k) or any kind of investment in stocks, chances are you paid a lot of money to sports this year. The CEO and his hinchmen got the benefit (like the sky box seats they buy) but you got to foot the bill.
Voice, I wish you would have even a slight general knowledge about people like Dr. Green before you condemn her to the "affirmative action" group. She would hold her own among you and me in any field she undertook. And your slur that graduate degree programs are nothing is just one of the urban legends that do the conservative cause no good. You are entitled to your opinion, just as I am entitled to mine. But let's base opinions on something that at least looks like facts gained from an investigation, rather than callous prejudices. --pwf
Wait a minute. It's OK for PWF to give his opinion about K. Kelly but it's not OK for voice of reason to express his opinion about Ms. Green. Something wrong with this picture?
What else is new??????
So little to do other than bash ole pwf. I respect Vocie's opinion. I just want him to gather some more facts about Dr. Green. And I can prove anything I post about the pontificator. I just want others to do the same. --pwf
That's right Voice should use the same burden of proof that the great PWF aka Puffer uses. Such as;
1. I read it on the mens room wall.
2. Over heard it from the next stall over.
3. It has been said...
4. I had a dream last night.
5. It was written in the Star Banner..
My late submitted ideas on education budgets. I would like to see attention to reducing the school budget by: 1- redefining the duties of the school Principals, 2- shifting some of the individual/neighborhood school administration to a centralized source, and 3- if the Board is not doing it, apply Clayton Ellsworth’s zero-based budgeting (especially in the admin. support areas).
Voice of Reason says . . . .
Blogs are just a way to get ideas out to other bloggers quickly - if I thought it worthwhile to get references for everything I place here I would do it. Blogs are no place to spend time giving references - this is just an opinion forum.
As to Capella University, anyone can Google them and see what they offer. It appears that their PhD program requires a 1000 score on the GRE OR a 3.0 undergraduate GPA. A 1000 GRE score is nothing, any undergraduate should get that no-sweat. But Capella doesn't even demand that - a prospective student can simply get 3.0 undergrad. GPA. Is anyone going to say that it takes a special person to get a 3.0 undergrad GPA? On top of that, if her undergrad or grad is in education it is much easier than virtually any other college major. Then, we add in the fact that Capella in an online degree "university." Those rackets used to be called "mail order degree" universities and would advertise in the back of Mad Magazine next to the X-Ray spy glasses.
As to her "Masters Degree" from Nova, that is the same thing. Nova is the place where people turn to when they don't get accepted into State school. It is very expensive compared to state tuition but has very relaxed entrance standards. It is considered a "mail order degree." Again, it is in Education so it is complete fluff.
Neither of those institutions are major research universities and have NO business giving-out masters degrees and PhDs.
Her undergrad is from North Florida which is a state school but much less competitive than the top-tier like FSU and Florida. Again, its probably in education.
The web site should show who paid for Capella and Nova. I bet Marion County taxpayers did.
Anyway, my attack wasn't on Ms. Greene personally but on her assertion that she wanted Marion County Schools to remain " King of the Hill." Again I ask, which hill? Mt. Marion(the landfill?) Her comments aren't based on any facts but rather Oprahized self-esteem boosting mumbo-jumbo.
VoR
Voice, no I'm not the blogmaster. Not enough time. You said
"As to her "Masters Degree" from Nova, that is the same thing. Nova is the place where people turn to when they don't get accepted into State school. It is very expensive compared to state tuition but has very relaxed entrance standards. It is considered a "mail order degree." Again, it is in Education so it is complete fluff."
Nove provides quite a good opportunity for working people to continue their education, and receive quite a good eductaion in higher degrees. No it is not a research facility, but neither are many good colleges and universities around the nation.
Frankly, judging from results from some grads of Florida and FSU, maybe we ought to listen to Nova grads more.
I understand your comments were not a personal attack on Dr. Greene
and mine are not an attack on an individual -- just their record and in one case, their being a phoney.
I want us to attain "king of the hill" status, but surely, you can't fault her for being positive and wanting to main and go further than saying "let us stay in the sand box."
Enjoy your comments. Keep them coming. --pwf
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